Joey: Okay, welcome. I'm here with Dr. Aaron Seaton of The Chiropractic Place and he's returning, his Ollie like return to the ring.

Dr. Seaton: Round two.

Joey: Round two, ding, ding, ding.

Dr. Seaton: My comeback.

Joey: You're on Hilltop. Right?

Dr. Seaton: On Hilltop Drive.

Joey: So what's your address?

Dr. Seaton: 1123 Hilltop Drive.

Joey: So people can stop by anytime.

Dr. Seaton: Yes. Anytime.

Joey: Monday through Thursday.

Dr. Seaton: We're not there right now.

Joey: Not yet. Not now. But that's one of the cool things about your practice is that people can stop by. No appointment necessary. Get in, get out. So, I know I get adjusted at least once a week. I have a ruptured disc in my back and have had problems with it for a long time. And one of the things was that I would always wait until I couldn't move. And in incredible pain. And then I would go in, and then the adjustments would be incredible pain because it's like, man, you're really out of whack. And then I met you, and I changed to where I was like, no, come in once a week, let's get you dialed in, and then let's keep you dialed in because you're in a constant state of.

Dr. Seaton: Right. If you have any form of disc degeneration, that is an active process that's going on consistently. So one of the things that we know helps discs really well is because they don't have a very good blood supply. Discs need to stay moving in order to get nutrition in and get waste products out. That process is called imbibition. It's literally pumping food in from the bones above and below and pumping wastes out. So people who have these conditions who are only going in when they're in pain are ignoring the known physiology of how discs work. So, with my patients, I like to see them more consistently, especially when those conditions are going on because we're going to slow that process down and try to maintain that disc as best as we can when we do it like that.

Joey: What if you don't have disc degeneration? Is it just, that you should get it adjusted frequently?

Dr. Seaton: My personal feeling on it is that people should be checked consistently and regularly by their chiropractor. This concept of chiropractic care should be no different than how we look at our dental health. Chiropractic is best at preventing long-term spinal health issues, especially if we start chiropractic care very early in life. The last thing we would do regarding dental care for our kids is tell them to wait until they're 30 years old and they've developed dental problems before we teach them about proper dental health. So, my goal in my office is to have my patients embrace that same ideology they have for dental care, which is to start your kids early and teach them to take care of their teeth so we can prevent long-term problems. Chiropractic should be viewed in the exact same way, in my opinion.

Joey: I've been going to you for, I'm going to say, close to two years, definitely over a year.

Dr. Seaton: About two years, yeah.

Joey: And every now and then, I do something silly, lift and stiff legged or whatever. But I think about, like, in the last two years, I haven't had those episodes where I'm, previously, I'd had some episodes where it was like, oh man, I couldn't move. And there were going to be painkillers involved just to get through, which is horrible. And I want to talk about that, too. I want to talk about maybe some alternatives to the conventional. Right now, everybody knows the ills of opiates, right?

Dr. Seaton: Right. Absolutely.

Joey: Now that we went through that whole late '90s, early 2000s where doctors were just writing, Vicodin scripts and oxycodone and all that kind of stuff. So we know, but what's the alternative then? So when you are in pain, but back to me coming in, I haven't had any major episodes. So I'm a big believer now. I've drunk the Kool-Aid.

Dr. Seaton: Right, there's actually a lot of docs in my field right now trying to get us on more of these programs where we're considering. because there are a lot of studies right now going into how we help with the opiate issue and how we help people with pain relief and pain management. And so I've found it's effective if people suffer from spinal-related issues. Regular chiropractic care can help definitely address that. One of the issues is if you've been on pain medications for a long period of time, certain pain medications can actually cause the pain fiber of a nerve to sprout and grow even bigger.

Joey: Great.

Dr. Seaton: So think of it like this: here's your body giving you this signal. And it's at volume three, and then you keep putting medication in to numb that. So your nerve responds to that and says, I'm going to turn up the volume then and sprouts and grows bigger to turn up the volume. So you'll see the people who have been on long-term pain medication when they're not using it, they're in massive amounts of pain compared to somebody who hasn't been using that. And that's because their nervous system has responded negatively to that medication. Does that make sense?

Joey: Totally. What would you consider long-term?

Dr. Seaton If you're on it for years, you're more exposed to this, and according to one of the docs I know who knows a lot about this research, there is a point of permanence with this. If you get to a certain point, I'm not sure of that number. Still, people can develop permanent chronic pain problems from pain medication because their nerves are literally growing and sprouting to send more pain signals. After all, you're numbing the signal and not hearing the body, so the body responds that way. Hopefully, that makes sense. Hopefully, that's not too confusing.

Joey: No, totally, it's like your body adapting to it saying, I should be feeling some pain. I'm not, so I'll just. So I can grow back stronger. What are some alternatives to the conventional? Are there any, like, I don't know, I've used the term homeopathic or whatever, but what are some?

Dr. Seaton: Touch like. Especially if you're dealing with physical body pain, touch fibers actually when you touch your arms, say you get burned, you're like, oh, ouch, ouch, ouch. Why do we do that? Why is that a reflex? Because actual touch and sensation fibers will inhibit the pain fiber right at that level. So getting consistent touch, like bodywork, chiropractic care has been shown actually to decrease pain because of that relationship there. Another thing is movement and exercise, but with people who have had chronic opiate use long term, there's going to be a period of time that they go through as their body has to adapt to come off of that medication. If we're still in that period where their nervous system can change, where those nerves can actually shrink and not do what they're doing, continue to grow and sprout, you can have a lot of things to help them.

Dr. Seaton: One of the things that, too that is getting popular CBD creams and stuff like that. Personally, I don't use them myself, but I'm happy if a patient's using them instead of something harder on their body. I'd much rather. In my office, my guiding tool when I'm looking at stuff with people is compared to what? That's always a question I have in my mind. Compared to what? Well, CBDs, we don't know of any real known long-term side effects of them yet. Obviously, more study is a good idea, but will I tell my patient who's taking Vicodin not to try this? In my office, I would tell them if that's helping, and I've had several patients come to me and say, I've got this CBD cream. It's really helping with my pain. My advice to them is, I'd rather you be doing that than taking something that we know has these long-term effects on your body.

Joey: Oh yeah. I noticed that in the wrestling and the jujitsu circles, CBD creams suddenly popped up very quickly and what's the term, like salves, or what are those called?

Dr. Seaton: Salves.

Joey: Salves, yeah. So I was so close, I missed by that.

Dr. Seaton: You were there.

Joey: I missed it by that much, but all of a sudden, those sprouted up and became very, very popular. And to me, they're using them, and those groups, when I think of wrestlers and people that practice jujitsu, are not like, oh yeah, they love marijuana. It's like, no, these are guys on the Bengals, on the mat, really exerting their body. They're usually, their lifestyles are very, very healthy.

Dr. Seaton: Right.

Joey: It's not Big Max. It's, and so for that to have popped up in that area, I was like, wow, okay, maybe this could be real. Because you can never, with all the information, you don't know what's real or not. Everything's sensationalized.

Dr. Seaton: Right.

Joey: And so there's been a pushback on medicinal marijuana and then there's like, well, there's the THC, which is the chemical that everybody thinks of marijuana in part, but then there's this other chemical that's produced that's supposed to be a pain inhibitor. So, there are no long-term studies; I guess it hasn't been around longer.

Dr. Seaton: I know they're starting to do them, and I am not the expert on the CBD stuff. They're definitely starting to research it. The feedback from patients is just basic case studies that you see from your patients, but they're having a real effect on these people's lives, which is great. And I like CBD as the non-psychoactive ingredient. So we're not dealing with them walking around feeling high all day or anything like that. They're just using a known molecule to help alleviate their pain. So I'm okay with that with my patients if it prevents them from taking something very serious because that pharmaceutical solution that we just went through was devastating to our country.

Joey: Oh, huge.

Dr. Seaton: And still seeing the effects of it, so.

Joey: Oh yeah, absolutely. And all of the rise of the second phase where you have the methadone clinics where they're putting you on another heavy drug to try to get you off the first heavy drug. So it's just a bad path. What about other stuff? I take turmeric because it is anti-inflammatory. That's a good one.

Dr. Seaton: Right. What I've seen with turmeric that I've read is that it's a potent joint inflammation and anti-inflammatory. And it has also shown some anti-melanoma effects that it has as a side benefit to it. I've also had patients who take turmeric on a consistent basis who have noticed a big difference in inflammation in their joints. So that's another great supplement if you are dealing with something like that. That works pretty well from what I've seen.

Joey: What about Glucosamine, Chondroitin? Is that?

Dr. Seaton: Glucosamine and Chondroitin are building blocks in the joint that help create the cartilage. So, Glucosamine tends to have a much higher absorption rate. Chondroitin sulfate is a much bigger molecule. So your body, from last I checked, absorbs about 15% of that. Chondroitin sulfate you absorbed around 85%. So it's much more absorbable. And that's really, any supplement comes down to that. Absorbability. How much did you take in? Is it useful?

Joey: Well, we started getting collagen from you. We got collagen from a big box store, like a big brand. And you and I talked about it, and you talked about the size of the molecule and how we were buying these huge things, ingesting it, but our body wasn't really absorbing it because the molecule was too big.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah. And that's just some basic chemistry on stuff. Molecular weight matters. And when you're looking at certain supplements, knowing that. And a lot of people don't know how to look for that. We offer 100% hydrolyzed collagen in our office because we know the molecular weight of that collagen, and it tends to be 15 times smaller than what we've seen on the shelves at the store. And it's 15 times more absorbable that way. So, if you're going to get a supplement, the whole goal is to have your body absorb it and use it. So that's why I brought that product into my office because I've seen people experience differences in days to weeks when they start that level of collagen we usually put on.

Joey: I didn't notice a big change, but I have incredible hair and nails, so maybe I'm not.

Dr. Seaton: Nice.

Joey: Yeah.

Dr. Seaton: Perfect.

Joey: So maybe I'm not the right. No. But my wife immediately noticed a difference in her hair, nails, etc. And that's just the stuff you notice. And I'm sure it has other, what, like joints? Where is it helping?

Dr. Seaton: Yeah, all of our connective tissue basically in our body is made of certain forms of collagen. Not only do we tend to think of the musculoskeletal side or hair, skin, and nails, but your blood vessels are made out of collagen, and if you have damage in your blood vessels, it's nice to have lots of collagen around if your body is trying to repair stuff. So collagen has that effect. I always make sure I would let people know it's not an end-all, be-all. Nothing is. Collagen can serve a role as we get older. Our body has trouble synthesizing more and more collagen. So, a collagen supplement can be good in that regard, but it certainly is not the only protein you should take in. You need to be taking in other proteins as well.

Joey: Like?

Dr. Seaton: My favorite thing to have people take is not necessarily a supplement but consumption of wild salmon. There's rarely a protein source that's going to be better than that because salmon's loaded with vitamin D. It's higher in vitamin D than just about anything. You get the Omega-3 content of it as well. So, consumption of salmon on a more consistent basis has to be wild if you're going to get those benefits. That's another good thing to be taking in.

Joey: What's a consistent basis when you say that?

Dr. Seaton: A couple times a week I would say.

Joey: Really?

Dr. Seaton: Yeah.

Joey: What about, you always hear about mercury. Is that an issue with salmon eating that much?

Dr. Seaton: Typically, mercury tends to be higher, if I'm correct on this, in the larger fish. Salmon, yes, mercury can be an issue. But at least twice a week, I highly doubt you'll get an exposure to mercury that would cause neurotoxicity or anything like that.

Joey: So, okay. I take Omega-3, we buy the wild salmon, I'm talking about oil. So that's a good one to take, then. Is it something that good if I can't eat wild salmon twice a week?

Dr. Seaton: Right, it will not be the same. It's not going to be the same one-to-one on that. It's hard because we like to, in the West, we tend to like to break things down to the individual molecular level and say, this is better than that or it's the same as that. It's not; if you're consuming Omega-3s in a wild form like salmon, you're probably more likely to absorb those. You can take Omega-3s as a supplement, which will still benefit you. But I always remind people that supplements are exactly that. They're a supplement. They're supposed to supplement your diet, which should be solid before we go on this path, we should try to get that good, then start adding some of this stuff in. But many times, people get a little carried away with the supplements, and then their mind gives them permission to be a little more lax over here. So, I try to acknowledge that in the beginning.

Joey: So, I met former world champion Rich Franklin through a friend, and the guy's in phenomenal shape. This guy was the world champion at UFC, and he still is. He's like, I think he. He's either. He's a couple of years younger than me. He's probably 45. And if you follow him on Facebook or Instagram, you know he's in really good shape. And I asked him, "Hey, what kind of supplements are you taking?" He's like, "I don't take any supplements. I eat, I eat all my supplements." The closest thing was he had a. He suggested this green powder he bought, which was just ground-up plants. And talk about tasting bad. I was like, "You know what, I'll just eat the plants."

Dr. Seaton: Right.

Joey: Because it was brutal, but I was kinda shocked. You don't take supplements? No, but then he explained his diet, and if you saw what he ate daily, you're like, good lord, man. That was, it seemed like a lot of work. He was. He eats super healthy.

Dr. Seaton: But you look at the results.

Dr. Seaton: The results.

Dr. Seaton: He gets. I know. I think Urijah Faber was another one who didn't. He would juice. He would do stuff like that. Juicing with a juicer. And eat really healthy. And that's where he comes from. That's his foundation. And with athletes like that, they have to be even better with their diet because there's nothing else helping them, so to speak. So they have to really have that dialed in. And for me, I'm okay if somebody. If somebody needs some supplements, there's a genuine need for them. But definitely, the diet, the water, those things matter. What's going in consistently matters more than, in my opinion, just throwing a bunch of supplements in there and hoping they help.

Joey: Okay, so let's say we're not professional athletes, and I can't eat wild salmon twice a week. You get what I'm saying. I'm an office person, I'm this, that, what are some supplements that you would, if someone was like, hey, you're not quite getting enough. What are maybe the top three or something like, "Hey, well then, take this at least."?

Dr. Seaton: I'll usually talk to people about doing a multivitamin or multi-mineral. One of the issues there, though, is a lot of the multivitamin products out there have a lot of B vitamins, and then you start reading their mineral content and it's like next to nothing. So you want to find a good product with natural ingredients, not synthetic preferably, and a whole food source, and you want those mineral numbers to be good. Usually, those sub. People kind of get lazy there. I just want to take one little capsule and that's it. Well, we can't fit everything into one capsule, so you'll often have to take three or four of those, but you want something that has minerals in it. You want something that has vitamins in it. But again, the caution there is don't become reliant on just taking a bunch of supplements. Keep your diet as good as you can.

Joey: Okay. So when you say a diet. We got salmon twice a week, wild salmon, that's crucial. But what are some other things? Is it the standard stuff like kale?

Dr. Seaton: Kale is great for you. I just, I personally mix it up, and I'm really good at cooking. I've always loved cooking, so I have.

Joey: And humble about it too.

Dr. Seaton: I have a. I'm not trying to be humble. I'm trying to brag here.

Joey: Okay.

Dr. Seaton: Because it helps if my diet needs to be good, and I'm good at cooking, it gives me a significant advantage in winning that battle. So, one of the things people can do, and it might sound silly, is if you don't know how to cook, learning some basic cooking skills, taking a cooking class is important because then you can start to create food that you actually want to eat. At home, I make a lot of stir fry. I make a lot of stir-fried vegetables because I know how to make them really well. And personally, I'm not eating a ton of steamed vegetables because it's just hideous. It's not something I enjoy. So, I tend to consume a lot of stir fry, and I can make it really, really good to where I want to eat it all the time. So, basic cooking skills can really help people out.

Joey: Well, you get olive oil locally out of. Where do you get it from, Orland?

Dr. Seaton: I get it out of Orland.

Joey: Orland, okay.

Dr. Seaton: The guy, Bill, has an organic olive farm there, and I pick up my oil from him. I have a lot of weird food relationships like that.

Joey: No, that's good. And it's all local stuff. We bought the olive oil through you. And yeah, it's. If you haven't had local organic, I guess it's fresh.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah. He. I mean, he presses it every year and we grab it.

Joey: So it's just like in the backyard. I've never been a big apricot person, but we planted an apricot tree. So you go out and, okay. I don't even know why I planted an apricot tree, considering I didn't really like apricots, but okay. Oh, man. That's like no apricot you've ever eaten in the store.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah. It's night and day.

Joey: It's all the fruit. It's the same way with that oil when we cook with it. 'Cause we were buying organic extra virgin olive oil from big box store type stuff, the big jugs, and thought, hey, this is great. But then when we tried the oil, it just, even when you open it up and you smell it, it's just the fragrance is way stronger. So I think it's just like the closer you can consume, and we happen to live in an area this isn't like Northern Michigan where it's like, well, good luck. It's all around us. I mean, the nuts, the olives, oil, the. You grow your own, you raise your own beef even.

Dr. Seaton: I grow cows.

Joey: You grow cows.

Dr. Seaton: In the ground.

Joey: That's proper terminology. We get meat from Hat Creek. I'm trying to remember. That's a local organic grass-fed.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah. There's a ton of. There's a. We have fewer excuses for finding good local food here. Our farmer's markets here are booming. There's tons of food. You can find local meat. If you want local eggs, you can throw a rock anywhere in my neighborhood, and you'll probably hit three egg people that you can get quality range-fed eggs, beef, chicken, everything. Brush Arbor Farms down in Cottonwood. You can pretty much get anything you want. So we can do pretty well with our diets here compared to other areas. California is just bountiful with food.

Joey: We even have. We used to be part of the dairy co-op in Cottonwood.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah. Duivenvoordens.

Joey: Yeah. I was going to let you say the name, the Duivenvoordens.

Dr. Seaton: They're my friends. So I better know their name.

Joey: We used to get. We kind of shifted off dairy. But man, again, the milk that you get from there, it's like, wow. Compared to normal milk. You're like, my goodness.

Dr. Seaton: You become kind of a snob with it. You're like, oh, is this store stuff? Ew, no, I'm good.

Joey: It was like. The sugar content, I don't know what it is, but it tastes great. The milk tastes great.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah. It's complete.

Joey: I just don't want to drink milk.

Dr. Seaton: They don't filter out anything from that milk. The cream content of it is not filtered. It's unadulterated.

Joey: No. You get in the jugs and it would separate. So we would. You would take the cream off the top, then the half and half, and then you, the milk and it's real. But it was great. So, we have a local organic dairy co-op. We obviously have several local meats, organic grass-fed, all that stuff. Farmer's market, I don't know when they start. I think it's not year-round, right?

Dr. Seaton: No. Typically, I think it's April through December. If I'm not. Don't quote me on that. I think that's when it is. But there's.

Joey: Oh, we're going to quote you.

Dr. Seaton: I'm lucky because I have a lot of patients that come in. I have this one gal who she. Her garden's dialed in. She's been doing it forever. So even in the wintertime, she's bringing me in broccoli and carrots, and you just bite, like with your apricot, you bite into a carrot from her and I'm like, I can't buy carrots at the store anymore.

Joey: So we have like a, I think farmer's market by the city hall.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah.

Joey: And then they also do it at the Turtle Bay, kind of that parking structure another day. And then there's another day.

Dr. Seaton: There's a week. I think a Wednesday morning one on Churn Creek. I know there's one out in Palo Cedro. They have one down in Anderson.

Joey: Are you talking about. When you say Churn Creek, is it by where Wilder's is? That whole parking area?

Dr. Seaton: Yeah. I believe they have one in there on Wednesday mornings or Tuesday mornings. One of. They were having one there on weekdays in the morning. So there's definitely plenty of access, and even the local grocery stores have awesome produce. You can find pretty awesome stuff around here. Even if you're looking for organic as well. It's everywhere.

Joey: How important is organic?

Dr. Seaton The study that I like to talk to people about so they can make their own decision on it they checked commercially grown, just standardly grown blueberries versus organic blueberries. And they found that when you have commercially grown, it's protected with pesticides and not being organically produced. The organic blueberries had 10 times more antioxidants present in the blueberry when picked compared to the commercial. So sometimes you'll spend a little more money for organic, but if there are 10 times more antioxidants because this blueberry had to protect itself, it didn't have artificially created protection. Those antioxidants have a direct effect on my health. So if I'm getting 10 times more from organic blueberries, but I have to pay 30%, or 40% more, I'm probably going to go with that. So that's one of the studies that I originally looked at that was, wow, that's quite a difference in nutrient value, so.

Joey: And I think, there's something about this whole organic being more expensive, that I agree. It is more expensive, but I think when you sit down and you look at how you spend your money and you're like, okay, we spent $180 on groceries instead of $145 because we went with organic, and it's like, it's more, but I mean, compared to all the bills you have and the impact that good food has on your health versus.

Dr. Seaton: Good food is absolutely paramount to your health at this point. You need to take in healthy food, and a lot of the times when people make that shift too, if you're not buying a lot. The biggest markups on food are on the processed junk, that's where the money is. The biggest markups are on those. So a lot of times when families switch to eating more organic, they might see the costs per thing of blueberries is, oh, that's a little expensive. But a lot of times it almost evens out because you're not buying the stuff that has 200%, 300% markups on it anymore. You're focusing more on healthy nutritive stuff.

Joey: Yeah. No, that's what I think. It's when you're sitting there and you're looking and there's the organic apple and the inorganic? Non-organic?

Dr. Seaton: Conventional.

Joey: Conventional or whatever, but it's like, oh, well it's $1.50 more, and so you think, oh man, that's so much more. But as you said, when you're buying these organic foods, especially if you learn how to cook, you're going to see a reduction in your overall spending because you're not buying all that pre-processed Stouffer's pre-made lasagna stuff.

Dr. Seaton: And you're putting healthier stuff in your body. Your quality of life will improve if you're doing that on a consistent basis. Obviously, nothing's an end all be all to health, but you can certainly minimize health issues by addressing your diet consistently.

Joey: Things you can control, things you can't control.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah. You're doing. You're basically.

Joey: You can control what you put in your mouth.

Dr. Seaton: Exactly. We have a degree of control over that, so we need to do that regularly.

Joey: So we got supplements, I think we talked about, you said just a multivitamin, multi-mineral.

Dr. Seaton: And that's case by case. I mean, more.

Joey: Not vitamin D, not Omega-3, it's not the big ones?

Dr. Seaton: You can definitely add those, especially this year, people's. After eight weeks of smoke from the fires and then a really hard winter, this is usually when you start to see lower D levels show up in January and February because people have had no sunlight. If they're not consuming a lot of wild salmon or sources of vitamin D, you start to see D levels go down. Seasonal affective disorder, stuff like that.

Joey: And vitamin D you're going to get in a. It's going to be an oil, so it's. Or we've to get separate, right?

Dr. Seaton: Yeah, vitamin D.

Joey: At least that's how get it?

Dr. Seaton: Can come in a little capsule. It can come in a gel cap form as well. So it all depends on where you're getting it. But that can be important. But it also, case by case, it's hard to kind of just give black-and-white advice to people on health, like are your D levels low? If you have somebody where 30 is usually the cutoff and they're at 25 and you see that on the lab, they need to get their vitamin D up.

Joey: Would you suggest people go in and get lab tests before they check out their personal chemistry or no, not too much?

Dr. Seaton: Yeah, if you're getting. If you want to get as objective as we can, yeah. If you have unknown food allergies or you're having ongoing health stuff, I think you should.

Joey: How do you know if you're having food allergies? What are the symptoms?

Dr. Seaton: It all depends, if somebody's having a known reaction or say they're showing fatigue after eating something on a consistent basis if they're having obviously the obvious ones, is there any swelling in your throat or anything like that? The best way to do that is you run IgG panels on them and look at food sensitivities, and food allergies for them and see if there is something that they probably shouldn't be consuming. And you can always recheck this stuff later down the road too, to see if they've eliminated that allergy. So that's the best way. The most objective way to do it is to run food allergy panels on people.

Joey: Because besides the big ones, people are allergic to shellfish and it almost kills them or something or peanuts is one that's. Is it just like you just don't feel good after you eat? Or what about bloating and stuff? Is that a sign?

Dr. Seaton: Yeah, you can. Bloating, swelling, digestive pain, fatigue is usually a good one. More so than the others that I've seen. A lot of people, if they eat something their body does not agree with tend to get this malaise almost, like they're tired. So that's something to look at as well when you're analyzing that. But nothing's better than getting objective measurements on that.

Joey: 'Cause as I was going to say, I try to think. I'm not keeping a personal journal so I can't. It's like, every time, dear diary, every time I eat spinach, I feel fatigued. You know what I mean? I'm like, I don't know, sometimes you just, I don't feel great today. Is it a food allergy or did I just not get enough sleep or is my body fighting off something? So I guess it's like I need to go in and get tested.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah. And there's a great NorCal natural medicine, Dr. June Stevens, she's a naturopath here locally. She does an awesome job with that stuff. She tracks a lot of that stuff, and everything's case by case. And if we're getting really in detail with somebody, that's the best route to go is to look at your own individual stuff so we can understand what's going on.

Joey: My wife was having some issues, nothing major, but she went in and the doctor. We have a great family doctor and he said, "I think your vitamin D levels might be really low." So he sent for a blood panel and sure enough, she had really low vitamin D or whatever the trigger that says, hey. And so he said, "Hey, up your vitamin D," immediate change, all the issues she was having immediately, so.

Dr. Seaton: If you have low D, you're going to see it. A lot of people start to express symptoms of that and you can catch it on a very easy blood test. You just ask to check their D levels. So it's very easy to figure out. And vitamin D if you need to supplement is not expensive.

Joey: No.

Dr. Seaton: It's very inexpensive to be honest, so.

Joey: Where do we get vitamin D if we're not taking supplements? I mean, the sun, right? Being out in the sun?

Dr. Seaton: Sun. Yeah. If you want activation of vitamin D, we need sun exposure consistently every day as best we can. The best source of that is going to be the wild salmon. You're going to get a big dose of vitamin D from salmon.

Joey: Are there any vegetables or anything there with vitamin.

Dr. Seaton: Mushrooms have some, I'm not sure. Yeah. Mushrooms have some vitamin D, but not to the extent that, I mean, wild salmon or if you're like, cod liver oil, those things are loaded with D, that's where people get their D from primarily. Definitely, it's hard. I'm going to keep harping on the wild salmon. It's hard to beat that.

Joey: Duly noted, but, I'm just saying, we're inland. So what's your access to wild salmon twice a week in Redding, California?

Dr. Seaton: The one that I typically go for in the off-season, I'll buy the wild Alaskan sockeye salmon from Costco. They'll have the frozen individually wrapped, pieces of the wild sockeye. But I usually can't wait for salmon season to open up, cause then you can get it fresh right there at Costco. You get a fresh pretty much anywhere when it's in season.

Joey: We got some. We have a friend of the family whose son goes up there and works the fishing season and every year we buy salmon and.

Dr. Seaton: Smart.

Joey: Put some of the fruit. Now, it's not twice a week, it's more like twice a month, but it's. The flavor is.

Dr. Seaton: It's unbeatable.

Joey: And we hit R&R market, and they. It's hit or miss. It's seasonal and what they have and stuff like that. So it's the same thing. And they have the farm, but they flag it like this is a farm, this is wild, that kind of stuff. But there's no plant or fruit or vegetable that you could think of it's salmon or supplement or.

Dr. Seaton: No. Salmon's the best source of it. Mushrooms, I know there are more, but they're not coming to me right now, but salmon being the highest, if you want a real dose of vitamin D, that's one of your best things that somebody could actually keep.

Joey: Do you have shares in salmon stock?

Dr. Seaton: I do.

Joey: I'm feeling like a.

Dr. Seaton: I'm selling salmon right now actually, online.

Joey: Online?

Dr. Seaton: Yeah.

Joey: So, okay. Vitamin.

Dr. Seaton: It's farmed but I label it wild.

Joey: On the. Hey, traditional, but I label it organic. So Vitamin D is a big one. What are some other big ones as far as just supplement things that we should be eating? Is it just like, is it as simple as it cleans?

Dr. Seaton: Clean water? As silly as that might sound, your water needs to be clean, your body's 70% water. Your blood is 90% water. You need clean water going in on a consistent basis.

Joey: What's clean water? We're talking about water that didn't go through a radio. A nuclear reactor because it's dirty water.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah, definitely avoids.

Joey: Is it like public water is the garden hose?

Dr. Seaton: Yeah.

Joey: Yeah, for half a day.

Dr. Seaton: Just. The best, if you're getting a bottled water source, I know Voss is really good, high-quality water. I think some of our local places do a pretty darn good job too on the water. If you're getting it just through the tap, it's probably a good idea to have some additional filtration put in. So you want water. And a lot of times, when we process water, water can kind of cluster into bigger water molecules. So we typically know of water as H2O. Well, when it clusters, if it's processed it can become H200, 0100. So we want that molecule to be as small as it possibly can, just like other molecules we've talked about. Because you want to absorb it in and use it. So that gets a little complex. Start. I tell people that eight glasses of water is very real. Every bit of your biochemistry exists because of hydration, and not being adequately hydrated will affect everything else. So 64 ounces of water is a lot for some people, but it's very important for you to be hydrated because every single thing you do in your body is based on it.

Joey: We have a Burkey, a friend suggested, we bought a. Burkey Is a company that makes water filters, we have the big tower one, and once we started using that, that's when we noticed when you go to drink water from the sink, that's when you can really smell the chlorine, that's when you can really taste even the metals, The water takes on a different. Before you're used to it. So I'm. I don't know what other water filter systems are. The trigger that for us buying that Burkey was, I don't know, a few years ago there was a study that there was a certain amount of, I think cadmium in our water, and it's a super carcinogen, if that's even a right term. And they were like oh, it's this super trace amount that. Don't worry about it. But then the following reports, scientists have said there is no amount that's not dangerous. So it's like which is it? Is there an amount that's in our water that's not dangerous or is there no amount that's not dangerous? So we went looking for water filter systems that said, hey, yeah, we'll pull the cadmium and stuff like that out of the water.

Dr. Seaton: We'll pull. Yeah, the major stuff out. Any heavy metal stuff, chlorine itself is a known carcinogen. Not that it's bad. I don't want to sit here and bash chlorine because it's getting rid of communicable diseases in water, is a good idea. But at the same time, chlorine can have an effect on our body if we're exposed to it consistently. So we also have to acknowledge that. So that's why I think having a good filtration. We're actually in the hunt right now at our new house for a good filtration system ourselves so that we can process that stuff out too.

Joey: Now the other side of the coin, with some of the water filtration systems, is that it yanks a lot of the minerals out that are necessary.

Dr. Seaton: Right, that's the thing that I don't know a ton about, but I know RO systems that pull all the minerals out. Then if you don't have the naturally occurring minerals in the water, the minerals to balance that water out are going to come from somewhere and that could come from your tissue. I haven't read those studies so I'm not completely up to date on them, but that's the theory behind not wanting to drink a ton of RO water.

Joey: Because I've seen these water filtration systems that have rocks in them. You know what I'm talking about? You go into some doctor's offices and stuff and they'll have the water and then there'll be the rocks. And the rocks are like, oh, that's magnesium, calcium.

Dr. Seaton: Mineral sources.

Joey: Yeah, mineral sources. And it's like, because the filter pulled them out along with all the bad stuff. So we gotta put the good stuff back in.

Dr. Seaton: So we're mineralizing the water.

Joey: Yeah. I need to do some more research on ours, I just know the water tastes way better. So we bought a couple of our family members gifts. We bought them Burkeys and they like them. Well, immediately they're like, wow, didn't realize.

Dr. Seaton: I've known you a while and I did not get one, so I think maybe for Christmas this year.

Joey: You're not part of the inner circle, Greg.

Dr. Seaton: I'm not RN, the circle of trust?

Joey: You're out of the circle of trust now.

Dr. Seaton: The nest?

Joey: Yeah.

Dr. Seaton: Okay.

Joey: I was just, that reminds me, I don't remember getting gifts from you, so.

Dr. Seaton: I did send them to Becky, she probably just forgot to tell you. Anyway, next topic.

Joey: Next topic. So have you seen, there's this, I don't know how. Somehow I fell into the slipstream for these ads for these devices that are these posture things. So it's these braces that you, it shows the guy and the gal and they're, before they're like this. And of course, they gotta be sad. It's the the classic pre-post and they're like, oh, I'm so sad. And then all of a sudden they're like, but now with the new posture, I'm wondering if it's the old belly buster workout devices and stuff or does that, have you seen any of these things? They're like these posture girdles.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah, I've seen a few of them online, the reference I have there is when back braces were pretty popular. And people were using back braces anytime they'd lift. Well, there's a researcher, his name's Nikolai Bogduk. And this is the guy who actually researches this stuff to determine if is this helpful or not? And he found in his research that they were actually causing atrophy in their lower back muscles on a massive scale too.

Joey: It makes total sense.

Dr. Seaton: If they lift without it now, they're more likely to be injured. Far more likely to be injured because they've just atrophied everything that held them up. So my concern with something like that would be, no, I totally get that you're trying to help somebody's posture and improve their posture, and altering where those ligaments are can bring them up more, but are we doing, if you're wearing that all the time, every day.

Joey: Which is I think how they were selling it, because it's like.

Dr. Seaton: Now that holds your spine up, and your muscles don't. So what happens to your muscles? It's really simple.

Joey: Atrophy.

Dr. Seaton: What you don't use, you lose. It's real. If I don't use my arm, my biceps are going to get smaller. If I don't lift something, my muscles are not going to be there. So my concern with those would be that, do we have any real known long-term study on the effects of wearing these all the time? How about we get those people up moving more and not, I have to sit at this desk uncomfortable all day, but now I can be even more uncomfortable by being like this and forced in this position.

Joey: What about like chair, you see the people that have the, they've taken the balls, the exercise balls and turned them into chairs and stuff. You know what I'm talking about? Is that good? Is it because it forces you to sit a certain way?

Dr. Seaton: For certain amounts of time. That's the thing, for certain amounts of time. Our bodies are not designed to just sit in a chair all day.

Joey: But what if that's your job?

Dr. Seaton: That's the tough part.

Joey: Or if you're an air traffic controller?

Dr. Seaton: There you go. Have the co-pilot grab the wheel, and find an excuse to go to the bathroom. That's what you need to do. Now, if you're at a desk six to eight hours a day, we need to find ways to get you up and moving around. Sit-stand desks are really great for that so that we're not always in the same position. It's not that sitting is evil, it's just sitting all the time is not good.

Joey: Or holding one position all day, yes.

Dr. Seaton: Yes. Standing all day is also not good. So sit-stands are great because it allows people to kind of have some flexibility with being at their workstation. And then I always tell my people, to find an excuse to go to the water tower or use the bathroom. Like, you need to move. Remember we were talking about discs earlier? And I said discs have to move to get nutrition. All joints have to move to get nutrition in and waste products out. So when we sit, what I'm doing is I'm telling my spine, the load on the lower back just went up 50%. So you have to work 50% harder, but guess what? While you're doing that, you get no food and no waste removal. That's a recipe for disaster long term, right?

Joey: I agree.

Dr. Seaton: So that's why I tell people you need to, if you can do a sit-stand desk, do it so you can get up and if you can move around, you need to move around. And I've gone so far as with some of the executives who don't mind. If they're honest, if they have a sit-stand, I put them on a wobbleboard while they're working.

Joey: You put me on one.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah. So you're recruiting balance muscles and giving your brain something to do. Your brain hates this flat, boring world that we're in. It likes to wire for sensory changes to fire the muscles. So that's why I like doing the wobbleboard. I did that when I was in school, and I'd see people at two o'clock just crashing. They drink a cup of coffee thinking it was going to perk them up, it never happened. But at my school, my chiropractic college, we had standing desks in the back, so I brought a wobble board every day and I'd stand at the standing desk taking notes, never got tired, because my brain was not just shut off from sitting there bored doing nothing.

Joey: So if you. So the sit-stand desk also, is there like a time like, hey, every two hours, stop and walk for 10 minutes or?

Dr. Seaton: I think so. Yeah. Definitely.

Joey: Something like that?

Dr. Seaton: If you're like Driv. So a lot of people from here, I'm driving down to LA this weekend and I'll see family or whatever. I tell them, you need to pull over every couple of hours and move. Like, get up and move around. Don't stand, but like, get up at the rest area, walk around, stretch, move, your body needs that to get food in and waste out, especially in the joints. If they don't move, they just start to lock up and that's not good.

Joey: Are there any products out there that you go like, hey, so we got the sit-stand desk?

Dr. Seaton: I like those. I like. If people are at a desk a lot, yeah. Using a sit-stand, having options so you're not stuck in one position.

Joey: It feels like there's a reoccurring theme with you, and it's like.

Dr. Seaton: Move.

Joey: Move, eat as close to raw as possible, meaning like the least processed food.

Dr. Seaton: Just try to eat as best you can. Move around. My patients that I have who are well into their nineties, the ones that are doing quite well move around all the time. They still do a lot of stuff themselves. That seems to have a pretty big impact on our longevity is movement. My grandpa, he was president of his walking club into his late eighties, early nineties. Even when I went to visit him, he walked four miles a day. Like movement matters. Our heart isn't the only thing that circulates blood, or lymph. We have to move to move that stuff around. So movement is vital.

Joey: Your lymphatic system only works, it's like a pump by gravity or something. It's. How does it work?

Dr. Seaton: Movement helps circulate the lymph system. Movement circulates the venous system too. Like the return blood to the heart, like why can't you lay a patient in a bed for days on end without that becoming a problem? Their legs can begin to swell because movement, the muscles contracting helps push blood back to the heart as well. So we need to move around for every aspect of our health.

Joey: Just saying this makes me want to get up from this chair and go for a walk. I remember two things. Number one, there was a book called The Blue Zones. I don't know if you're familiar with it.

Dr. Seaton: I'm not.

Joey: They studied these pockets of people that lived longer. They had the most number of centennials. And then so they were like, okay, there's, and it was like Okinawa, Hawaii. There's some places in Italy. It was. An odd one that caught me was Loma Linda, California. There were a few different places. And so they went down there and said, why do you have more centennials than average? And what they found was that they moved a lot. So there's a few things that they said, and I think one of them is, you're going to, no, but one of them was that, they ate less meat than average. On average they ate meat five times a month. The Loma Linda is, because I can't remember the, it's like the Church of Latter Day Saints or something, it's.

Dr. Seaton: Gotcha.

Joey: One of them that they're vegetarians. They had a very high, they ate a lot of nuts. They ate a lot of beans, their diet was very, very close to the earth. The processed foods was very, very low.

Dr. Seaton: They're eating healthy whole food.

Joey: They said that they didn't have very many gym memberships. That's one thing they didn't see. But what they saw was they had very walking lifestyles.

Dr. Seaton: Active.

Joey: Active in that they were in like their jobs or their lifestyle was movement. And so I just, that. A bunch of people living to be 100 years old, they're doing something. And also their alcohol consumption was really, really low. If not, or no alcohol at all. So that's one I'd like to talk about is, how devastating is alcohol? Because it's very accepted. Our society has. You know what I mean?

Dr. Seaton: Alcohol, it is a processed carbohydrate. That's what it is. It's a processed sugar, that's a sugar alcohol.

Joey: Well, you hear things like red wine. Oh, it's got. A little bit of red wine is good for you. Is that bogus? Is that real?

Dr. Seaton: There are certain antioxidants in red wine, but they also can be loaded with sulfites as well, as part of the wine process. So are there other places you can get antioxidants that are healthy for you?

Joey: Organic blueberries?

Dr. Seaton: Yeah. Yeah. Veggies. A lot of veggies are loaded with antioxidants, broccoli, and blueberries. I mean, you can get antioxidants, so that. I just, it's a socially accepted thing, but it tends to be more harmful than we'd like to believe. If you're consuming alcohol a lot, multiple times a week, it's going to have an effect on you at some point in my opinion. In my opinion, you have what's called the hepatic portal system which is the blood that kind of comes through the liver. And we can see people who consume lots of alcohol, I've noticed in people who have consumed lots of alcohol long term, the hepatic portal system is also linked to the blood vessels in the face. You might see these venous, these veins popping up on their face and stuff like that. So the drainage that takes place, because the liver is under so much stress, has more trouble.

Dr. Seaton: The other thing that you're doing is, why can you only have one alcoholic beverage per hour if you're going to drive or something like that? Because it clearly takes the liver about an hour to process out either one shot of alcohol, one beer, or one glass of wine. So it's a toxin to your body. So consuming it all the time is not a good idea. It's just not a good idea. If you're trying to be healthy, I would try to avoid alcohol. If you're having it once a month, okay, your body will probably handle that. A lot of people, you tell them once a week and then it ends up being three times a week. So it does more damage than people think. And the long term, if your goal is to be really healthy, trying to avoid consumptions of alcohol is a good idea.

Joey: Okay. So mark that one off.

Dr. Seaton: I'm the world's most boring human.

Joey: Just super healthy.

Dr. Seaton: Did you want to go get a Quinoa kale salad after this?

Joey: Exactly.

Dr. Seaton: Or take a walk. I have to be in bed by eight o'clock though.

Joey: Some filtered water. It's like, man, so what can I have?

Dr. Seaton: My poor wife. My poor wife.

Joey: What is your vice? What is your food vice that, like what do you, because you're painting this picture of, I don't know.

Dr. Seaton: Believe me, I'm not an angel. I'm not perfect.

Joey: Because bread is really bad, right?

Dr. Seaton: Too much of anything. Too much processed carbohydrates is not a good source of fuel for your body. Like eating too much bread. If you're going to consume bread, I would go more towards like sprouted organic bread, because you're going to get more of the nutrients out of that. The fiber content's going to be higher.

Joey: So is that like the bread that's in the free, like the Ezekiel bread in the freezer, they have to keep it?

Dr. Seaton: Ezekiel bread or Alvarado Street Bakery. They're down in Petaluma. They make sprouted organic bread as well. Sometimes that's available at Costco up here, which is great. But yeah, those tend to be the most.

Joey: Refrigerated, right?

Dr. Seaton: Yeah.

Joey: Because?

Dr. Seaton: Preferably, or if you're going to consume it, consume it quickly.

Joey: A sourdough any better than like, I don't know if I've heard that like, oh well, sourdough bread's a little bit better as far as bread go.

Dr. Seaton: You can even make, not that everyone, because like, I like to cook. So you can have your own sourdough starter we do at home, and you can get sprouted flour to make your own sprouted sourdough bread. It's a great time.

Joey: Wow.

Dr. Seaton: It's awesome.

Joey: You're really close to the earth. That's awesome. That's awesome.

Dr. Seaton: Well, for kids though, I mean, if you've ever made homemade sourdough pancakes, kids love those. Oh yeah.

Joey: That's a nice.

Dr. Seaton: Homemade sourdough pancakes.

Joey: Yeah, homemade sourdough pancakes. No, I've never heard of. What?

Dr. Seaton: That's a family tradition at my house.

Joey: Buttermilk pancakes, but not sourdough pancakes.

Dr. Seaton: I just blew your mind.

Joey: Yeah. Now, you seem pretty moderate as far as the diet, you know, you're, I mean, talking about like meat and vegetables, there's this big movement right now. It seems like there's always extreme movements, but there's like the big vegan movement and then there's this other movement that I've started to hear about where these like super carnivores where they're like, no, we just consume meat. Have you seen any of that stuff lately?

Dr. Seaton: I'm aware of them. I do consume certain meats. Obviously, my goal with my meat consumption is to try to get it as local as possible. Like why? I enjoy raising our cow. We just have a few cows that I raise with my best friend. And it's fun to do, because the kids get to learn where food comes from. They get to help raise these animals. But at the same time, I get to control what goes into that animal. I know this cow is not being fed genetically modified corn and soy. I'm giving this cow nothing but grass. And we use a particular breed called the Dexter cow which is a great small farm cow and very feed efficient on grass, meaning they marble well off just eating grass. Like if you put them next to other cows, they're going to fatten up better on just grass than other cows.

Joey: I remember hearing something about like, prior to World War II, that's just, all of our beef was grass-fed. And it was the proliferation, and I can't remember the exact steps, but that's when all of a sudden supplementing everything with corn became wildly popular.

Dr. Seaton: And the big issue that I have with it is like when you look at beef grass, like truly grass-fed beef, and you look at the Omega-3 to Omega-6 ratios, and this is why people hear about Omega-3s, is the Omega-6 to omega-3 ratio, we try to be anywhere from one to one to three to one, six to three. And our diet, I've heard is as high as 50-1 in favor of Omega-6s versus Omega-3s. Omega-6s tend to be very pro-inflammatory. Omega-3s tend to be more anti-inflammatory. So when you look at grass-fed beef, the content, is that meat actually has a far better ratio of six to three when that is pure 100% grass-fed beef versus something grain-fed. So that's why I like to do it because occasionally I want to have a burger or I want to have a steak. So if I raise that and I know where that's coming from, your Omega-6, and Omega-3 ratios are far better in that meat.

Joey: I think it was corned beef was such a delicacy prior to like World War II. It was like a big deal, right? Corned beef, it's like a big deal to be rich enough to be able to feed your cows corn was a big deal. Now we've, it's.

Dr. Seaton: It's everywhere.

Joey: Yeah, and it's.

Dr. Seaton: And now people are going the other route where they want more grass-fed stuff. I mean, it's, we've done the. These studies have been done on eggs too. Cage-raised, you know, farm-fed eggs, their six to three ratio, Omega-6 to Omega-3 is like 17-1. If you take a pasture-raised hen that's roaming around eating grass and bugs and you're supplementing with organic feed, their ratio is anywhere from 1-1 to 3-1, 6-3 where you want it to be.

Joey: We get our fruit and vegetable delivery and eggs locally from country organics. It's a local delivery service. Shout out to Albert. And the food is, yeah, especially the eggs. If you've had fresh eggs, the taste is. And the color, like you look at.

Dr. Seaton: Look at the color. Look at the vitamin A content in that yolk versus the other ones. It's insane.

Joey: They're dark. Yeah, it's nothing alike. So the point is, local, organic. 'Cause I remember years ago hearing that in America, on average, food has traveled 1500 miles before it gets to your plate. And I'm thinking that a lot of those numbers are the fast food industry or any of the pre. The truck pulls in from Los Angeles and then gets dumped out. So it's not just like, oh, they mean they're organic tomatoes driven. No. So that's first off, the health is a big one, but the second thing is, that's just bad economics. If you have to pay to ship something 1500 miles, and I get it, if you're in Northern Michigan, you probably don't. You don't have a choice. We do.

Dr. Seaton: It's easy for us to talk about local organic food here in Northern California because it's just so accessible. But in other parts of the country, there's absolutely a need for them to bring in fresh produce, stuff like that. So for us, it's great if we can get it locally, and be able to get it, whatever we want, do that as best you can. In other parts of the country, that's why I try not to be so rigid or hard fast on it because it might not be real. And like you said, northern Michigan or somewhere else. And the food systems that we've developed in this country are by far the best of anywhere in the world. You can get pretty much anything you want at any store at any time. And that also has had a major impact on our life expectancy and the reduction of communicable diseases because we have such great access to nutrition as well.

Joey: Do you know much about like the aquaponic movement as far as growing, is it. Do you know anything about the nutrition?

Dr. Seaton: I don't, I haven't looked at that.

Joey: But you're familiar with the idea of growing in this like hydroponic environment, where you introduce some type of animal in the water, usually fish. It's like tilapia is a big one, where it's the byproduct of the fish, feeds the plant, the plant cleans out the water, and oxygenates. It's this whole, you're trying to make these ecosystems. So those are starting to pop up in places like British Columbia has a lot of them, if you go into the store, there's these little tags, greenhouse grown, I think that's even their website, greenhousegrown.com. And there are several of these. And they have these huge, giant greenhouses, and they're growing in hydroponic and aquaponic systems. So those are popular. And so northern Michigan can get it.

Dr. Seaton: They're like using fish as the fertilizing agent for the plants?

Joey: Yeah, fish and.

Dr. Seaton: Wow.

Joey: I've seen some, me and my kids did one, we used coy and grew butter lettuce. It was just a science project, and it totally worked. And it's a real simple system that's.

Dr. Seaton: Very cool.

Joey: It was pretty cool. You have a couple of filters in there and you've. The more intricate systems you'll see they have multiple species. So they'll have.

Dr. Seaton: That's awesome.

Joey: Fish A, and the first tank is let's say fish A, and fish A eats this and that and then this goes down and fish B is in this water. And then they'll have shrimp in the very last one. And it's pretty cool. And,d oftentimes, they'll have like the first pool of water, they'll grow, I think it's called duckweed. Does that sound right? It looks like. It's like a green film that's like, it's like a plant that grows on the water, and they're like, oh, well, that filters this out. But also they feed the fish this duckweed, and there's some great. If you'll do some.

Dr. Seaton: Brandon, Joey's growing duckweed in his garage.

Joey: I want to. I have no time.

Dr. Seaton: I hope you're watching this, RPD.

Joey: In between getting up every two hours to walk in my sit-down desk and my waddle pad that you got me, and taking my collagen with my vitamin D and catching wild salmon.

Dr. Seaton: I'm glad you brought up duckweed because that was the next supplement I was going to say is a must.

Joey: I'm trying to find, well that's.

Joey: So, but no, it's a really neat movement. I think you've. You'll often see that movement coupled with the tiny house movement, and you'll see it if, I don't know if you're familiar with earthships, but. Are you familiar with earthships?

Dr. Seaton: I'm not.

Joey: Oh, man. So earthships, that's a great topic. I will let you do some research before you come on next time.

Dr. Seaton: I'm going to do my homework.

Joey: On earthships. But also out there, if you want to check out a guy named Amory Lovins, he is arguably one of the most intelligent people on the planet. He runs the Rocky Mountain Institute. He did. His is an earthship. Because of earthship, there's a certain lifestyle, like a bohemian lifestyle, tied to it. And I think that turns a lot of people off. So we'll go the other way and say, okay, how about this guy and his crew? And they all have multiple PhDs from, name, the top 10 universities in the world, and they build these completely efficient homes, and they're usually built into the earth a little bit. They use natural light, they use, these are the kind of homes like, I think he had this huge house in the Rocky Mountains covered in snow. They call it the banana house because he grows bananas inside his house. And he said his utility bill, it's like a 5500 square foot house. His utility bill's usually around five bucks a month. Yeah, because it's just good design. So he gets hired by people like General Motors and some of the larger.

Dr. Seaton: To be an efficiency expert.

Joey: He comes in and asks, how can we make these vehicles still reach safety standards but at the same time emerging fuel efficiency standards? And so like his big thing was, I think he was working with. They were making carbon-based body frames, and he started to get into graphene and some other things, this cutting-edge science. But anyway, so I digress.

Dr. Seaton: I've got homework to do. I feel so out of the loop.

Joey: I was just growing butter lettuce off of koi fish poop.

Dr. Seaton: That's awesome.

Joey: Break it down to a click bait, grow.

Dr. Seaton: And I'd like to talk to you about homes that are built into the earth now, if I may.

Joey: Oh, I would love. They're awesome. Check it out.

Dr. Seaton: I will.

Joey: I'm a nerd. I know I am. I get into it.

Dr. Seaton: If next time we're here, and I smell patchouli oil and you're wearing a tie-dye shirt, I'm going just to run. I'm just going to say that.

Joey: I have salon quality hair, so I can't.

Dr. Seaton: I am kind of jealous right now.

Joey: I can't walk away from that. You know what I mean? I got some hair patchouli. That doesn't go with it. Anyway. So, thank you so much for coming on. I really appreciate it.