Joey: I'm here with Dr. Aaron Seaton, owner and operator. I always like that owner and operator, just in case...

Dr. Seaton: Owner Operator? Yes.

Joey: It's not one of these chiropractors who owns the place but actually works in another area. This is an actual owner-operator of the chiropractic place.

Dr. Seaton: Yes.

Joey: So thanks for coming in today.

Dr. Seaton: This is number one.

Joey: I know you're not nervous.

Dr. Seaton: No.

Joey: But I'm nervous enough for both of us. So... We were talking about stem cells. I'm going to jump right into it. The most controversial topic I can think of is, well, I'm getting mixed signals with the whole stem cell thing. Some people are saying that it's miraculous, and other people are like, no, it's still unproven.

Dr. Seaton: It's in its infancy, to be honest. In our country, we're behind. We had a very long debate discussion on stem cells. So stem cell we're behind on stem cells. There are a lot of uses for it. And the whole concept, a lot of people don't understand it. That's usually what it is, a lack of understanding.

Dr. Seaton: You have a very simple concept, which is you have stem cells, cells that are undifferentiated. They are just basic primordial cells. They are not liver cells or bone cells. It's just a cell. This cell, when introduced into any environment in your body, can become the cells of that environment. That's what it is. So if you have a knee issue and the cartilage in your knee is wearing out, and we introduce stem cells into that environment, they can become chondrocytes which make cartilage and regenerate cartilage. So that's what's very exciting about stem cells. That's what I like about it, is that we're actually, rather than just treating a symptom, we might actually be addressing the cause of that problem and fixing it. That's what I found. I mean, virtually anyone you talk to, that's what they want when they go to a health care professional is a solution. And a lot of times what we offer is symptom management. And that's not really what they want.

Joey: When I hear about it, it's mostly joints. It's mostly, hey, I had it. My knees. My shoulders. Yeah. But I've heard some and kind of cringe because I don't know if I'm quoting gossip, but I've heard some people talking about shooting them into organs. You know, I heard something about the liver. Yeah, liver.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah. Yeah. They're looking right now. They're starting to do studies on Parkinson's and many neurological issues. Obviously, spinal cord trauma is a very big interest. Somebody had quadriplegic, paraplegic. Somebody had a trauma there. And we can regenerate those cells. There's a lot of interest, but it's still very new. It's just getting research behind it, funding behind it, because, let's face it, there's a lot of money in keeping people in a chronic state of illness. I don't think it's any secret that most of the illnesses we see are now chronic managed illnesses rather than how are we fixing the problem of stem cells. If we can fix a lot of these issues, could pose a big threat to a lot of money that's been coming in year after year for certain interests. So there will always be a pushback when you're talking about billions and billions and billions of dollars.

Dr. Seaton: That's my personal opinion.

Joey: No, I have friends in the pharmaceutical trade, and they used to joke that cure is a four-letter word. Control is what you want. You want to control the disease, not cure it because cured people don't. And I know it's real easy to bash Big pharma, big this big that, sure, capitalistic society just it's it's going to do both things. It's going to you're going to have incredible innovation like we've never seen. But you're also going to have for-profit drives morality. And that's where we have the struggle. And those and the idea that you can get rid of one or the other and keep, Oh, we want the innovation, but we want this altruistic approach. That's not how this works.

Dr. Seaton: No, it's not real. There is a give-and-take there. You're absolutely right. The capitalist society we have driven a lot of R&D, for there is a for-profit motive there that helps drive research and development. But there's also a lot of government funding through the NIH, National Institute of Health, that also drives R&D and works hand in hand with the capitalistic society. So we have this we have phenomenal research and development. It's just steering that in a direction not just in the interests of pharmaceutical or drug surgeries. The big question, the big thing that I have that I struggle with, we're having this conversation about health care right now in this country. We've had this conversation for a long time about whether to pay for it individually or whether to pay for it nationally. But rarely do you hear during this discussion, which is a discussion about health care. Why are we not discussing the paradigm itself? You have 5% of the world's population taking 50 to 60% of the world's drugs, and we are no healthier.

Dr. Seaton: We are, in fact, the least healthy of the industrialized nations. We're the most obese. We have the biggest chronic long-term health problems of any industrialized nation. So how do we address the health care issue if we're not even willing to say The paradigm that we're using is going off of a cliff, whether we pay for that individually or collectively? You can have that argument. But the reality is the paradigm is not working. It's just not working. That's why per capita, you look at Australia, you look at Canada, they're half their cost per person is half per person because they're not taking all the drugs, all the surgeries, just constant procedure after procedure, intervention after intervention. That's my issue with the model we have now do you keep it where it's constantly about reimbursing medical providers for procedures or interventions? When do we start incentivizing health and well-being? Say, I'm your medical doctor, and I get you to quit smoking. What do I get paid for that in our country? Nothing. What if I have a conversation about your health? Well, and your diet, and we adjust that. There's rarely a bill that I can associate with that—health and wellness education. So, we have a system that incentivizes procedures rather than actual health and wellness.

Dr. Seaton: That's a big flaw in our model that until we address that, we're really not fully talking about healthcare as a whole. I don't care what side of the fence you are on until we address that. We're tiptoeing around the elephant in the room.

Joey: You know, the two points that I think of when you say that, and I first off, I completely agree, is one is that you do have to figure out how to incentivize it. Because the whole idea of what we said earlier at capitalistic society, you lead in innovation. The problem is everything boils. Morality boils down to profitability. And that's not necessarily a great moral code. So we have to incentivize financially, incentivize good health. And that, to me, that's how you spin that mall around. Instead of incentivizing controlling the disease, you actually incentivize curing the disease or even being proactive and attacking the disease before you even get the disease.

Joey: Sure. Healthy life choices. And you're right that the conversations usually get hijacked by, for lack of a better way to put it, politics. It usually becomes this whole left-right thing when it's like, what are we? Wait a second, we're talking about the health of every American, everybody. Not just this group or that group or this financial, we're talking about everybody that these things. And so I don't know. I have a, we could, this could lead this conversation into politics, and I don't want to do that because then it really polarizes it. But I know what you're saying is true. As far as what it is? It's not even, what'd you say? You had the term for it.

Dr. Seaton: Industrialized nation.

Joey: Industrialized nation, yeah.

Dr. Seaton: First world. Are industrialized societies.

Joey: Where I just saw a special on opiate use, you know what I mean? And just our level of opiate use is it's insane compared to the rest of the world.

Dr. Seaton: It's, yeah.

Joey: Highly addictive drug. That's, you know, you hear the term gateway drug all the time. I think there was truly never a gateway drug. It's your gateway drug. Yeah, I know that. I told you I have a spinal injury. Yeah. For my military service. And on more than one occasion, it's like, Hey, we'll give you these opiates. And I mean, that's okay. I was in a lot of pain but felt like I was wrestling with the devil. You don't because you need two of them as soon as that wears off. And there's a just a whole host of side effects. None of them are good. Right? And it's like, where does this cycle end? You're going to have to detox yourself. Yeah. You're going to have to go through detox. That's how the cycle ends. And a lot of people can't, or they transition if they get cut off, they get, they transition to something else. Yeah. They have to.

Dr. Seaton: It can affect anybody from any socioeconomic position. The thing that's so scary about it is you can have a high, a super high-end attorney get hooked on these from an injury. You can have any. Anybody can get addicted to these substances. They're highly addictive substances, and yeah, they're great for managing pain, but what's the cost? You know, what is the cost of.

Joey: They're short-term answers, and they're being used as long-term answers. And that's.

Dr. Seaton: Well, and again, it sort of gets back to the paradigm discussion I have, which is, is pain bad? We're always conditioned to think, if I have a symptom, I'm supposed to get rid of it. Symptoms, in many cases, are your body's part of the healing and regenerative process, but every time you have a symptom, you're told to get rid of it, even your kid. Think about how this goes back to when your kids are sick. My kids don't take any medications whatsoever. They never have. Not one has ever entered my kids' body, so I may be far on that side.

Dr. Seaton: But what are you teaching your kid if every time they have a snivel, a cough, a fever, to take something? What has just been conditioned into your child that when I don't feel good, I reach for this rather than, Hey, son. Sometimes life isn't so comfortable and that's part of life. If a medical intervention is needed, then we're all people and you should intervene. But when does that start? We start at the sign of the very smallest symptom. Parents freak out and intervene. And that, to me, is dangerous—long term.

Joey: You're Making me feel guilty because I've got children's Motrin and children's Tylenol in my cabinet and now I'm thinking like, no, I can see myself giving the speech. You know, pain is weakness leaving the body, and this is an opportunity for you to grow stronger. So.

Dr. Seaton: I don't mean it like that. What I try to do when I talk to my new moms, when they have their children and obviously a very common concern for many moms is when they have a fever, well, we have this basic conversation: what is a fever? Okay, your body's temperature's going up. So what causes that? Most of the time, you'll hear, oh, the virus or the bacteria, wrong. You're a part of your brain called your hypothalamus regulates your temperature. The minute it senses an infection, it turns up the thermostat. Because when you turn up the thermostat, a few things happen. Number one, your metabolism increases. Number two, viruses and bacteria don't live so well above a hundred degrees. Number three, you start cranking out immune cells faster.

Dr. Seaton: That's why you speed up the metabolism. That's why you turn up the temperature. So, the fever is not an accident. It's not a byproduct of the infection. It's a direct response to it. And we're taught to think the fever is bad. Get the fever down rather than not. Let the immune system learn to fight. That's what it needs to do, very much like a muscle. You have to work it out to get it stronger. So those are some basic things that always kind of tie back to my issue with the paradigm of health that we have in our society. A basic understanding of fever could help parents be a little smarter about the decisions they make regarding the health of their own children. And that affects the conditioning of that child throughout the rest of that child's life.

Joey: You know, when you're saying that, I thought because just the way my mind thinks is that these are things that should be taught as part of our educational system.

Dr. Seaton: It would be nice.

Joey: You know, rather than my children. Okay. Who is the 13th president, and who is his vice president? Like, hey, let's talk about health. Right? I think we hear. Commonly, high school kids need to be taught personal finance.

Dr. Seaton: No.

Joey: That's a big one.

Dr. Seaton: And that's huge, there's a huge gap. I would say that finances are the two biggest gaps I've seen in the education system. We've homeschooled our kids. We do. We're very proactive with what we do. And sometimes homeschooling parents can get a, there's a little negative stigma there about, we're just keeping them home for X, Y, Z reasons. But many of the children I see are so much further along in their maturity than a lot of their peers in school that I've interacted with. That's just a personal opinion of what I've seen. But those are two big issues there that I see too. Just personal finance in health. Why are they not being taught that what you put into your body matters, whether you exercise or sit playing video games for eight hours matters? That adds up at some point. Your body is very resilient, but there is a breaking point for everything mortal. Your body will resist smoking for decades. It'll resist poor diet drinking. It'll resist all of our stupidity for decades. But at some point, you'll have to cash that check. You've been writing for a long time there.

Joey: So there's hope for me. Is that what you, is that what's that?

Dr. Seaton: There's always hope.

Joey: I heard a message of hope in there so.

Dr. Seaton: There's always hope. The cool thing about what I get to do is that I love patients. Patience. I get, they're like, well, aren't you sad that you don't get to prescribe drugs? No, I'm thrilled. I don't want anything to do with that. Not that it's wrong or there isn't a time and a place, but I don't want anything to do with drugs and surgery. I have to help you naturally. That's what's so cool about it. It's your body healing when I'm adjusting you, your body responding to the care. That's what's so cool about it they get this sense of empowerment again. It's not always something that needs to be done to you; it's just we need to turn on what's right with you rather than always try to fix what's wrong. Does that make sense?

Joey: Address the problem versus the symptoms?

Dr. Seaton: Yeah. And then allow the body time. You want to regenerate millions and millions of new cells from this old injury. Well, guess what? That takes time. We have an, "I want it now culture" and that's just not real. Especially as we get older, it takes longer amounts of time for us to heal, but that patience and understanding will get us through. I haven't taken pain medications for anything. I haven't. I don't take anything ever for years and years and years. And it's just learning patience that this is a process. You're healing is a process. Sometimes that takes a week. Sometimes it takes six weeks. But there is a process. You can do things to encourage it, but you also have to learn patience. And that's, to me, part of being an adult.

Joey: Your background's obviously, it combines athleticism and academia. I mean, you went to school for what, probably seven plus years.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah, eight years.

Joey: You were an athlete in college?

Dr. Seaton: Not in college. I was, it is funny.

Joey: I thought you had an injury, though right? That's how you got on this path?

Dr. Seaton: Yeah, I was training, I was, I boxed when I was younger and I boxed for a few years and that was the sport that I loved. Not exactly a team sport or something most people want their kids to do, but that's the sport that I love. I enjoyed that. I enjoyed that. If I got beat up, that's on me. You're in there alone. You're in there in the ring alone. So I liked the fact that it was a very individual sport.

Joey: Let's not use the term control freak.

Dr. Seaton: Control freak is right?

Joey: Focus on you.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah. No, you're right on the money.

Dr. Seaton: No. But that's, that's what I did. And then I went to school for eight years and did junior college and then like a pre-med, pre-chiropractic program that you have to do to get all your certifications done and then went on to chiropractic college for four years.

Joey: But you told me you had like an injury. You, because you were on a different path.

Dr. Seaton: Yes, I was.

Joey: And it was an injury that kinda sparked this.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah. I was injured at, it was, I think it was 19, I was 19 years old, and I herniated a disc in my lower back that was horrible to where I was dragging my left leg. That's how bad the nerve was being irritated. I was losing control of the leg, and I went to the MD, and the MD was like, well, there's nothing we can really do. Just take medication, and there you go. My girlfriend at the time was working for a chiropractor, and I hadn't been, and she told me to come in and see him. And so I started going and seeing him and just feeling so much better after I would get adjusted. I'm like, wait a minute, there's nothing we can do. And then he began to explain to me what I was, what he was doing, how the disc needed to move to heal.

Dr. Seaton: The discs have very limited blood supply, so they need motion to get nutrition from the bones above and below. So if I am locked up, restricted, not moving. Right? How is that disc going to eat? So it was really cool learning this stuff at 19. I was really smart on health and exercising and then you learn these new things and you're like, wow, this is amazing. So I was studying to be, I was looking at the accounting program at the time and another experience I had was interacting with these accountants and just seeing how unhealthy and sedentary they were. They sat all the time. They ate like crap. And I was, and that was not who I was. And then those two experiences are what set me on the path to becoming a chiropractor. I wanted to move around, I wanted to be up and moving, and I wanted to be involved a little more, in health and wellness.

Joey: Are you, you have any siblings, brothers and sisters?

Dr. Seaton: Yeah, three older brothers.

Joey: So I was okay. 'cause I was wondering if maybe this background, if your family was very athletic and very, 'cause even at 19, even to go through these things, the fact that you picked up on those two things at 19, you know what, Hey, wait a second. I'm looking at their lifestyle and I'm not appreciating this lifestyle.

Dr. Seaton: Right.

Joey: And just the wisdom of this person telling you like, Hey, no, this is how you can fix your body 'cause I went through something similar and I wasn't as wise as you at such an age. So I'm wondering if your family, you guys were...

Dr. Seaton: I was, it's always been there, man. I was... I remember being five or six, learning the meaning of the word entrepreneur and memorizing it when I was 16. I was 30 years old mentally. Everybody wanted to party and have fun. In high school, I was getting up at 5:00 in the morning or earlier. I my job on Saturdays and Sundays was at a local cafe, like a little hillbilly truck stop type cafe that opens at 5:30 or 6:00, so I had to be there at 5:00, so that's. I've always been mentally more mature than my age. I hang out with people who are a lot older than me. It's very rare for me to hang out with people my age.

Joey: Well, you're going to, that window is closing.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah.

Joey: Because.

Dr. Seaton: I'm getting old now.

Joey: Yeah.

Dr. Seaton: That's why I do those tough Mudder.

Joey: Yeah.

Dr. Seaton: It's an early midlife crisis now.

Joey: That's what's known as a good segue. So tell me, I have a basic concept, Tough Mudder, but give me the specifics.

Dr. Seaton: Tough Mudders or obstacle course type of train Spartan races, we do those two. You can do anywhere from like a five K, which is two and a half, three miles, to up to 14, 15-mile races with all kinds of obstacles. Some of them have shock lines when you go underwater and there's a lot of, you can get them as...

Joey: That's awesome.

Dr. Seaton: As intense as you want. It's basically like going through a bootcamp type of training. But honestly, coming from boxing, I'm used to training for something. Like anybody who's been involved in competitive sports like that understands that when that goes away, it's really hard to train the way you used to or stay at that competitive level because, without a goal line to cross or, you know, an opponent to beat, it's really hard to get cattle prodded into that motivational level. So I took those with my good friend John, a plumber in town.

Joey: John Jones.

Dr. Seaton: John Jones, yeah. Custom plumbing.

Joey: Custom plumbing.

Dr. Seaton: He's a good buddy of mine. And we're physically built very similarly. We're almost the same height, we're almost the same age. So it's awesome that I'm competing with my twin brother over here. And John pushes me to train at a level that nobody else really does. So we schedule them together.

Joey: How many did you do a year?

Dr. Seaton: Right now, we've done the local mud run here, which is a kind of more fun recreation. We have a Tough Mudder on June 10th. Our ultimate goal is to do a, it's called a Spartan Beast. It's like 12 to 14 miles in Montana at 8 to 10,000-foot elevation.

Joey: Whoa.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah. So we're psychos about it. We're pretending we're still young. That's how we convince ourselves we're not aging.

Joey: If you're going to do something 8 to 10,000 feet, you're either going to have to get one of those, what are those chambers called? The oxygen, the hyperbolic there.

Dr. Seaton: John and I are probably camping out in the tent for a month up at Mount Shasta. Just live the good life. That's the plan.

Joey: A month in advance.

Dr. Seaton: Probably. I do not know.

Joey: How long does take to acclimate that whole acclimation?

Dr. Seaton: We're crazy enough. Typically, what you want to do is if you're trying to acclimate to higher levels, you need to give yourself a few days per thousand feet. So if you're going to race at 10,000 feet and you're used to, say 2000, well, there's an 8,000-foot deficit that you have to gain. So you need at least two to three weeks, and I would wager at least a month to be able to train at that level effectively. So anytime you go up in elevation, the air is thinner, there's less oxygen, and you only have so many red blood cells. So when you go way up to 10,000 feet instantly, your body's like, "Oh crap, I need to make a bunch of red blood cells because we don't have enough oxygen around." Does that make sense?

Joey: Totally.

Dr. Seaton: So, I mean, that's what the acclimation process is, is your body just revving up, producing red blood cells that way you don't pass out.

Joey: Do you know what Elevation Mexico City is?

Dr. Seaton: It's 8,500. Mexico City's 8,500.

Joey: I remember when they had the heavyweight championship and Werdum.

Dr. Seaton: This is, yeah.

Joey: Fought Velasquez. And Velasquez seemed an almost unstoppable juggernaut.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah.

Joey: And I remember Werdum right before the fight saying in the buildup, he said, you're going to lose. You should have been here weeks ago.

Dr. Seaton: You're going to lose.

Joey: Werdum came, I think, a month in advance, rented a house and trained for a full month.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah.

Joey: Maybe more than that.

Dr. Seaton: Werdum was there for over a month and was at 11,000 feet If I remember correctly. He was above Mexico City and the mountains even higher up, training up there. It was the same. I remember back when Kenny Florian fought Joe Lauzon.

Joey: Yes, that's right.

Dr. Seaton: In Colorado, Denver and Kenny. He flew there a month before the fight and slept outside in a tent. They made his trainer make him sleep outside and Kenny, it's painfully obvious who showed up at the proper time. And when you fight at altitude, if you come late, you're going to be toast.

Joey: Yeah.

Dr. Seaton: I don't care how good a shape you are in at sea level altitude; it is a whole different ballgame.

Joey: You said the Mud run local. What's is local like in Redding, or where do you guys go there?

Dr. Seaton: Yeah, Shasta Mud Run, they do it every May now. Eddie Ner is the one who helps develop it, and it's put on through everyday fitness. They do a really good job. Every year, it's getting better. We had a great time. The obstacles are getting more and more fun. We get more and more of a turnout. I think this time we had, I don't know how many, I think it was 12 to 1,500 people, I want to say. It's really gaining in popularity. It's a one-day event. It's super fun to get.

Joey: What does that encompass, the mud run. What is it?

Dr. Seaton: That mud run, you could choose to do the five K or a 10 K. There's going to be 20 plus obstacles. And these are a lot. These are not they're challenging, but they're fun, too. It's a family type of setting. It's not like a competitive Spartan psycho race. So.

Joey: No electrical shock cords.

Dr. Seaton: No electrical shock. But you have to dive under, you know, go in the mud and under the wire. It's not barbed wire or anything like that, but it's meant to be good. I know you're upset.

Joey: Yeah, I was looking for raising wire.

Dr. Seaton: I was a little. John and I were disappointed. We were hoping there'd be. I was like, there's going to be some bullets whizzing by, something.

Joey: Some photo ops here.

Dr. Seaton: They do take good photos.

Joey: Viral videos, yeah.

Dr. Seaton: But there's no electrical shock therapy or anything like that.

Joey: Did you say you competed in it, so it just went by?

Dr. Seaton: Yeah. We did. We were at that one. We had a good time on that when that was kind, it gets the juices rolling for us for the year, and we start. John and I are starting to book out more events.

Joey: Have you booked it for the Montana one or did you have your month lined up at Mount Shasta?

Dr. Seaton: No. No, we don't. And that's the problem. It's right now until it's on paper. It's just a dream. So I've got to get it scheduled. We were thinking of doing that one next year.

Joey: What time when does that go down?

Dr. Seaton: That one, I don't know. I'd have to look. But they scheduled those ways out.

Joey: Montana, You'd think it would have to be summer months, right?

Dr. Seaton: I would assume it's going to be June in July or something because they're not pulling that one in February or something like that.

Joey: What are some other things that you do like physically around the area? We're completely surrounded by... Nature quite a bit, three national forests and three different directions. But are there any other things that you're involved in locally?

Dr. Seaton: Yeah, well, I like personally, I treadmill is a kiss of death for me. I can't, I can't focus. I can only run if I'm on a trail, and that's one of the great things I love about living here. We met up with John and Sean Peters from Peters Construction. We all meet up on Friday mornings at 6:00 a.m. at Tops Market. Jump in Sean's truck and go right to Whiskey Town and pick a trail we're going to do and we usually run about six and a half miles every Friday morning. And then, the great thing up here when it's really hot, Whiskey Town Lake's right there, so you can jump in right after your run.

Dr. Seaton: Perks you right up, come out. So, just this weekend, we're up in McLeod Camping. And there's a beautiful trail there. Cabin Creek Trail used to be called Squaw Creek Trail, and it leads to the Pacific Crest Trail. Just a gorgeous trail. You see all the water in there, beautiful ferns everywhere. I just ran that this weekend. So there's definitely plenty of stuff to do outside here. So I do train at home. I converted my garage into a CrossFit. I just spent the money and said, I'll convert this. But I love being outside. I can't, it's hard for me to be in a gym now. It's hard to be in a gym once you start training like that and doing obstacle course stuff. You just feel way more alive when you're out there.

Joey: No, I like it too. I have a hard time with the Oaks. This is the spring about a month ago. I was hurting.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah.

Joey: And, but absolutely. I like the outdoors much better. The big thing for me is timing because you do have to beat that heat. You want to get up and get in the morning. I like that 6:00 AM. I liked everything you said until you said six to seven miles. I was hoping you said like six to 700 meters, but you took it to the next level really fast. But I'm thinking maybe I can meet up with you guys and I could just maybe run the first 600 meters. And then do it in increments.

Dr. Seaton: There's no judgment out there. You're allowed to run what you want.

Joey: Oh, there's plenty of judgment.

Dr. Seaton: We'll tease you when you're not around. But when you're there. We're going to be polite.

Joey: It's not judgment to your face. You guys have more integrity than that.

Dr. Seaton: Joey, we'll be right back in a bit. Can you believe this guy?

Joey: Yeah, no kidding. You know, you said in there the CrossFit. And have you ever seen the documentaries on those? The fittest person on the planet. Have you seen those?

Dr. Seaton: I'm not. I've seen some of the games. I have yet to get into too many of the documentaries. Tell me about it.

Joey: Well, I just don't, I don't want to be, I don't want to, I'm watching these people, and they're, it's incredible. It's nothing short of incredible. It looks fake what they're putting their body through. Reebok puts it on and it's a multi-day and multi, and I'm like, how can these? I don't know how they can do it. I am curious to know how they can do it naturally. And I'm not hearing anybody say anything about, but they are in phenomenal shape. It's, it's crazy, but I definitely have no desire to do any of that. It's the kind of workout that when you watch them work out, my injuries start to speak to me.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah.

Joey: But I'm unlike you. I am quick to reach for Advil. Sometimes, I take Advil for no other reason than the taste.

Dr. Seaton: You're kidding me.

Joey: No, of course I'm kidding you. I don't know. That stuff's horrible. But, but I, I'm going to try a little harder. I'm going to do what you've motivated me. I've got an old Marine Corps t-shirt that says you know, pain is weakness, leaving the body. I remember when the brainwashing and the training were so good that I actually believed that. And there was a time, but that time is. I also remember a time when I was in jungle survival training. we were eating bugs, and they would never fly. I sent a steak back if it could be better now. So we're miles. That person doesn't even exist anymore. I've been, we're going to go to the lake this weekend. The rains have been, what a blessing, man. The last two years.

Dr. Seaton: It looked pretty dry for a while.

Joey: And it was, we were getting those like, Oh, it'll take. And I remember this right before El Nino 18 years ago, where the water was so low, the experts and they're out there, it'll, it'll take this many years.

Dr. Seaton: Right.

Joey: You know, to ever fill this lake up and two winters later, it's okay. We have to flood the park Marine area. Why? Because we have too much water and there's too much runoff. And so, if there was ever a time to get out to the water. It's whenever the University of Oregon students aren't there. Other than that, now is a great time to get out on the water. I guess they were just there, and they weren't as bad this year. So that's good.

Dr. Seaton: That's good.

Joey: Yeah. The bar was set pretty low last year, but no, they went out there and they, they partied. And I remember being a college student. We're...

Dr. Seaton: It's going to happen.

Joey: Yeah. I mean...

Dr. Seaton: We have big, beautiful lakes. You're going to attract people there that want to party on them and get a houseboat if not but. It was so nice driving over the bridge to McLeod this weekend just to see the lake I mean, that's, we're at the beginning of snowmelt too. And it's already full. And you're just like, yes.

Joey: Yes.

Dr. Seaton: So nice to see. Very, I'm very excited.

Joey: Do you fish at all?

Dr. Seaton: I don't, I like to talk a good game about fishing.

Joey: And that topics over.

Dr. Seaton: And hunting, but I'm, I'm really not the man's man of reading like the rest of them are. They hunt, they fish and it's pretty cold out there.

Joey: Well, speaking for all the man.

Dr. Seaton: Horses, that's about it.

Joey: I started fishing this year. I grew up in Alaska and moved here and the fishing kind of let me down. So I took a step away and then a friend is a fishing guide.

Dr. Seaton: Oh, nice.

Joey: And so he'd been, you know, nudging me, come on, come on, let me take you out. So I got tags and went out with a buddy of mine, Jeff. And we went out on the Sacramento just around Turtle Bay Bridge. This was last summer when the season, because I, I don't even know the seasons. That's the other thing. It's like, Oh no, you can't fish here. It's, you know, you got to fish over there.

Dr. Seaton: Right.

Joey: That's what the guides were for, but it was awesome. We did fly fishing. It's the first time I've ever done fly fishing in my life.

Dr. Seaton: Nice.

Joey: And we went out and you know, I told people my experience, and they were like, what's your first time? It was all the guide. I mean, he's like, no, do it this way. He gave me lessons. He obviously set everything up.

Dr. Seaton: Right.

Joey: He took it to the next level. He moved the boat and he's like, see that right there, throw your line right there. You know, this is the fish that likes to come in with the water swirls.

Dr. Seaton: Right.

Joey: And so anyway, we, we caught several trout, did a catch and release and it was trout season. Oh yeah, I took great pictures and he, he bothers me. Bothers me almost every day with like, hey, we got to go out. We got to go out. It's salmon season. It's you still ahead on the trinity. So I don't get to fish as much as I'd like to, but it sparked that fire that got squelched when I first moved here and went to Anderson River Park to catch bluegill after halibut and salmon fishing in Alaska.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah.

Joey: I was like, no thanks, but that sparked a, I'm not a hunter either, you know?

Dr. Seaton: Right.

Joey: I haven't, but it sparked this thing where I don't know why I have this sudden urge to go to Wyoming and shoot elk. I think...

Dr. Seaton: Around here, you have to turn in your man card if you don't. And I'm getting close to the expiration date, too, so. Yeah. You must go out there.

Joey: Nobody pressured me. It was just something about catching the fish suddenly. I wanted to arc all the way to...

Dr. Seaton: Yeah.

Joey: You know what I mean? It's like getting the slack fighting in the alley and then suddenly I'm calling out the champ and I'm like.

Dr. Seaton: You're in Reding now.

Joey: I want to know. They'll all talk.

Dr. Seaton: Talk to you here. Their conversations, too. I hear the guy like, Hey, I got this six-point this and that, and you just have to smile and nod and pretend you know what they're talking about. But I don't. But all the guys around here are really into hunting and fishing, and I'm just, so you and I will have to do it together then.

Joey: I told my wife, I told her this. I said, Hey, I have this weird desire to do this. She was like, what? And, and I said, and you know, what else? And this might've been the red wine talking.

Dr. Seaton: I think I had about three glasses in.

Joey: Yeah. I was three finger glasses of Pinot Noir and which goes completely with elk country.

Dr. Seaton: You're not supposed to tell people you drink Pinot Noir in Redding either.

Joey: So, it was scotch. It was Ardberg Scotch. It was a local brew from a local brewery.

Dr. Seaton: That's...

Joey: And I filled a jug they gave me.

Dr. Seaton: There you go.

Joey: So, and I said, I'm pretty sure if I kill this animal because I'm, I got, I'm, I eat meat, so I can't stand on ceremony. And I said I'm going to have to eat its heart.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah.

Joey: Like, you know what I mean? Like right when I kill it.

Dr. Seaton: You're going.

Joey: And so I was kinda like.

Dr. Seaton: Old school now.

Joey: Oh. I was psychologically prepping myself.

Dr. Seaton: Nice.

Joey: So I rented the Legend of the Fall, you know what I mean?

Dr. Seaton: You have to get sucked.

Joey: Yeah. Just like, okay.

Dr. Seaton: Little Brad Pitt.

Joey: Yeah, totally.

Dr. Seaton: There you go.

Joey: And then with, which then got me a fight club. Right.

Dr. Seaton: Oh no.

Joey: So I was like, okay.

Dr. Seaton: Netflix sent both of them?

Joey: Maybe instead of a rifle, I kill this elk with a knife. And then it came full circle and I realized I should stay local and fish for trout to fly fishing guy.

Dr. Seaton: You know how large an elk is, right?

Joey: Yeah. Kind of within bigger than me?

Dr. Seaton: They could. They fight back, from what I hear.

Joey: Yeah. But they're really slow. Right?

Dr. Seaton: They're really slow.

Joey: I don't know.

Dr. Seaton: They somber. So I could catch them in deep snow if I was running uphill.

Joey: Got long legs. They have a reach-rich advantage if they start jabbing you. It's going to be a long night.

Dr. Seaton: I go to spinning class three days a week.

Joey: That's pretty good.

Dr. Seaton: You know what I mean?

Joey: That's pretty manly.

Dr. Seaton: I feel like I could probably wait a minute. I felt that that's.

Joey: Easy.

Dr. Seaton: That's that boxer. That's the the jab. You have to establish the jab early. You.

Joey: Got the, you got the jokes coming out now. Yeah.

Joey: So no, I would like to race in Tough Mudder. If it meant.

Dr. Seaton: June 10th, if it was...

Joey: Got a spare seat.

Joey: A stationary bicycle in a room with disco and air conditioning.

Dr. Seaton: Nice.

Joey: And they bring a towel where I go, they bring a towel with like, I think it's eucalyptus and mint and it's ice cold.

Dr. Seaton: Very cold.

Joey: And so at the very end they come in with the towel.

Dr. Seaton: You're ready for Wyoming, man. I don't know what anyone else tells you, but you must pack and go to Wyoming.

Joey: I was thinking the same thing.

Dr. Seaton: Their hand.

Joey: I was thinking, but you know.

Dr. Seaton: That's all the training you need.

Joey: I can't find any first-class flights to Wyoming. So I'm caught up with this.

Dr. Seaton: No pain in noir on this flight conundrum. Unbelievable.

Joey: They're going to have in first class, they're going to pin in noir.

Joey: Apparently. You still need to fly first class?

Dr. Seaton: No, I haven't.

Joey: This isn't a Chardonnay flight, sir. This is, this is. Well, because you should know about wine, didn't you? You're from Sonoma Napa.

Dr. Seaton: That's the thing. That's probably why I don't hunt. I'm from Sonoma.

Joey: You up for a good Burgundy.

Dr. Seaton: I know about wine.

Joey: Yeah.

Dr. Seaton: Your wife will enjoy discussing wine with me.

Joey: Hunting no.

Dr. Seaton: I'm a wine drink. I'll order elk if it's on the menu at the five-star restaurant. If that helps out. There.

Joey: It was a nice Brune sauce. Is that?

Dr. Seaton: There you go. Yeah, no, I, yeah. Being down there, I love it down there. It's every time you're, every time summer kicks in around July. I'm ready to go back and visit Sonoma. Just the weather there is, we were spoiled down there.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah.

Dr. Seaton: Anytime I left that area like this is what people live in.

Joey: Yeah.

Dr. Seaton: I once went to Texas in June. That was a good idea. And it, you're like, you get off the plane, and you're like, oh, I didn't know you needed gills to breathe down here. It's quite humid.

Joey: So what brought you, so you grow up there, how do you, how do you find your way in Redding?

Dr. Seaton: So I graduated at the end of 2006. And we were originally, we were planning on moving back to Sonoma. My wife and I lived in Castro Valley then, down by Hayward, and discussed returning to Sonoma. But my friend, my good buddy Cory, Cory Meyer, is a town realtor.

Joey: Oh yeah, of course.

Dr. Seaton: He's, I've known him since third grade.

Joey: Oh wow.

Dr. Seaton: So, yeah.

Joey: Is Cory from.

Dr. Seaton: Cory's from Sonoma, too.

Joey: Okay.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah, we grew up together...

Joey: I didn't know.

Dr. Seaton: Went to the same elementary, middle, high school, everything. And he was just starting in real estate up here. So he came up just to visit and he's a slick salesman. because within a couple of months, I had a house here within a few months, and I don't remember how that happened. So he's good. He's good.

Joey: Yeah.

Dr. Seaton: So we moved out with, because of him and the housing market at the time, it's just looking at buying something in Sonoma. And so you're like, okay, so this moved.

Joey: And this is 2006 you said?

Dr. Seaton: Yeah, the beginning of 2007 at that point. So that's when we moved up here. So we've been here 10 years now.

Dr. Seaton: 10 years.

Joey: And how did you, did you immediately open up the chiropractic place?

Dr. Seaton: No, I did vacation relief work for the first few years that I was a chiropractor. Just getting more experience. I tried working at several offices, but it didn't fit me. The business models weren't fit, so I did a little more vacation relief, traveling around taking care of other people's patients while that doctor went on vacation.

Joey: Makes sense.

Dr. Seaton: So it was very fun. You get to, you get to meet a lot of people, but my wife became pregnant with our daughter, and you don't want me gone two, three weeks at a time all the time. And I didn't want that either. So we decided let's, hey, let's open up our office here.

Joey: Did you start the chiropractic place just from scratch, or was it like an existing practice? 'cause that's common, right?

Dr. Seaton: No, it was from scratch.

Joey: Okay.

Dr. Seaton: From scratch. We started in 2011, and I remember we had like a little closet. It was tiny. Our office was tiny, and we had my wife at the front desk at one table. And then, over in the corner, we had our baby crib, and our patients fricking loved it.

Joey: Oh yeah.

Dr. Seaton: They loved it. Our baby, our daughter Abby, was just this hot potato that bounced around from patient to patient while I cared for people. People loved it.

Joey: Very nice.

Dr. Seaton: Absolutely. Were like, this is so cool. And we're like, why do you even come here? This is a little shack, a little shanty of an office.

Joey: Not anymore. I've been to your office. It's not small at all.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah, it's growing now.

Joey: I don't drink and drive.

Dr. Seaton: They're mad at me that my kids aren't there. They're like, where's your kids? I'm like, I got a business to run people. I gotta get to work here. But yeah.

Joey: They're at home getting educated.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah. Yeah. Right.

Joey: So your wife homeschools them?

Dr. Seaton: My wife homeschools. She helps me with the office. My wife is, she's solid. She's always been that way too. It was, it was really cool when we met her.

Joey: You're fortunate.

Dr. Seaton: Well, yeah. When I met her man, she basically moved in with me within a couple of weeks.

Joey: Her parents might be watching this. You might want to. We will edit that part out.

Dr. Seaton: No, they're fine now. They're happy about this.

Joey: Okay. Okay.

Dr. Seaton: She, like, for three years before meeting me, asked every Christmas for a new blender, a new this, a new pot, a new pan. I stuck her.

Joey: Pragmatic.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah. She was just ready. And then she moves in and brings all this new stuff, and I'm like, "This is, this is gonna go over really well." She was just, she was awesome, man. It's never been work for us.

Joey: Oh, that's awesome.

Dr. Seaton: When we got together, it was so cool.

Joey: Yeah. And so, how old are you? Tell me you have two.

Dr. Seaton: My daughter Abby. She's five and a half. And then my son Andrew. My little titan of terror is going to be. He'll be three in August.

Joey: Very nice.

Dr. Seaton: The boys are a hard work.

Joey: I heard that it's a consistent message that the girls are easy at first and then when they hit teens, things start to, emotions start to take place. And so now it's, it's not. But with the boys, they come out with testosterone or something, physically, it's a completely different, Yeah. And it's, I mean, I know that that's not politically correct right now. I think the current is not supposed to distinguish. So, I will say there is a huge difference as a father of four, two and two.

Dr. Seaton: Big difference.

Joey: I mess with my girls. My two oldest are my girls. And I always mess with them and tell them, "You conned me into having more kids because they... I would say, "Hey, don't ever do that again." "Okay, Father, I shall never do that again." I'm like, "This fathering stuff's easy. This is so easy."

Dr. Seaton: Piece of Cake.

Joey: I should have some more. I should do a favor, do the world a favor and replicate myself even more than I already have. Just, I need to feed that narcissism. And so I did. And my last kid, he is he's either, he's either going to be wildly popular in prison.

Dr. Seaton: Nice.

Joey: Or, or he's going to be, he's, he's got it. So now if I can help him channel it and focus it, he's wonderful. He's physically I want to get him into jiu-jitsu.

Dr. Seaton: Yeah, channel it.

Joey: Make some strong friends and just channel it and learn to be comfortable with his physical form 'cause he's just very strong and he loves. You say, "Oh, it's TV or this." Maybe so. I think there are some inputs. But my son didn't have those things. And I go, and I meet other people with little boys and just, some of them are just the testosterone, or I don't know what it is.

Dr. Seaton: They're just. Yeah.

Joey: There's some, there's something chemically going on there. Okay. That is not, it's not like, "Oh, that's a bad parent." It's like, no. because I've, I've done the same thing with all four of my kids, and they are four completely different people. They eat the same. They all eat. We eat the same foods.

Dr. Seaton: They're wired differently.

Joey: And they are. Yeah. They've, so before I had children, the whole nature-nurture argument, I had leaned way heavier towards nurture. And then once I had four kids and saw just no nurture is huge. But I, I'll concede at this point it's 50/50.

Dr. Seaton: Right.

Joey: Because they clearly came out with personalities and physical traits that dominate how they interact in life. And it's kind of like one of those things we, I think we could have a lot of conversations and they would all come back to the same point of that. As humans, life is complex and we don't really like that. We like everything to kind of be. We're not machines, but we're pretty close to where we were. We want this to be like, "Well, there's a good answer and there's a bad answer. And it's like, it's not that simple.

Dr. Seaton: No.

Joey: And back to how we started this conversation with healthcare and stuff about like, everybody wants to politicize it and wants to try to make it this Us vs Them argument when it's like, no, we have.

Dr. Seaton: Or there are only two sides when there's really way more, or there's way more than that.

Joey: Yeah. Or are you saying that capitalism is bad? It's like, "No, no." It's a wonderful thing here. And when it goes unchecked, it has just like all things, it has the potential for some negative feedback. So well, hey, I really appreciate you coming here today. I know we'll have to have you again because I know we're running out of time but I'm grateful you came by, man.

Dr. Seaton: Thanks for having me.

Joey: Okay.

Dr. Seaton: This was fun.

Joey: Yeah, it was. And we'll do this again, I guarantee. We will. So thank you.

Dr. Seaton: Perfect.

Joey: After you do the Tough Mudder, like I'm talking like within 15 to 20 minutes after you do the Tough Mudder./p>

Dr. Seaton: So no shower?

Joey: No.

Dr. Seaton: Just full stink.

Joey: Yes.

Dr. Seaton: You got it. Dehydrated, hungry. And I will have gone through makeup just did.

Dr. Seaton: Oh, perfect.

Joey: As a contrast, just to really accentuate your man.